Jump to content

Welcome!

Sign In or Register to gain full access to our forums.

Photo
- - - - -

I want to see clan war.


  • This topic is locked This topic is locked
147 replies to this topic

#1 Vanadia

Vanadia

    Advanced Member

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 74 posts

Posted 31 March 2006 - 05:40 PM

I know it was here in the past, I wasn't around then. I'd like to known what it was all about, what were the good/bad things about it, why it was removed, and if anyone is interested in having it back.

Details, people. Details!

#2 Vswan

Vswan

    Advanced Member

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 256 posts

Posted 31 March 2006 - 07:35 PM

There are many other people that were deeper involved in the old clan wars then I was, but I did witness it all from the beginning to the end. I will attempt to relate what happened without pointing fingers at anyone, or condemning either side. So much of what happened was based on the player mentality at the time.... a time when guides weren't needed for transactions (for the most part) and a players word actually had weight.

In the old days when a player did something disrespectful or bent the rules in there favor. The players of the game would align themselves and either PK, trash talk, black ball, or block a player from playing. Rumors and gossip would float around about evil deeds (shout and gossip were global channels) and the players would begin to align.

There was no system code to encourage or discourage any sort of war, but Enigma clan #2 rallied much of the game into a frenzy over the play of Clan #10 Dark order. Dark Order had a few very creative player .. maybe geniuses... but they used those powers to benefit themselves and at times, at the cost of many others. So began the trash talking and hate mongering.

Things continued to esculate and allies of each clan got drug into the fighting... and Enigma at one point announced, EVERY clan, player and charactor in the game will HAVE to pick a side, they are either with us or against us. This was a bold move and really changed the entire game because Engima DID attack and kill every clan, player and charactor that didn't publicly support and back their movement. IF a player wasn't interested in getting or being involved they were sucked into the war by Enigma's killing....The down side is it created alot of dislike for the clan and even today they carry that old stigma.
Eventually Dark Order was beaten and left the game and Enigma reined supreme. (Please understand this is VERY generic and MUCH happened in that time .... maybe 2 yearish)

Some of the things that happened along the way. (Also generalized and glossed over to prevent any distrust towards players or IMM that might have "gone out of bounds".)

Remember the goal was PK, trash talk, black ball, or block a player from playing.(AND removing them from the game AT ANY COST.) Many clans were stolen, charactors hacked, the moat was blocked just about 24/7 (Enigma mostly), The keep was blocked and trunks locked down. Players cheated, lied and backstabbed each other... friendships were lost because of picking one side or another. Brother against brother and every player had a price and often they sold out on thier clan or friends. Most fountains and springs were poisoned, any food on the ground was poisoned. Naked pictures were posted on web sites along with players addresses and phone numbers as WELL as player WORK phone numbers.(I'm sure some lost their jobs cause they picked the wrong side) Moongate was hacked an held for ransom (for 2 days)and a few Immortals had picked sides as well and created unfortunate situations, and immortal distrust.

Most of the old players look back with fond memories. It was very exciting , dramatic and choatic. Every day was an adventure in survival, with clan PK happening the the streets of all towns all over the world... getting from one side of town to another could be a serious challenge. It really was an excitting time to be in the game.

I hope that helps you understand the basics of what happened.

Vswan

#3 Blitzen

Blitzen

    Advanced Member

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 1311 posts

Posted 31 March 2006 - 08:19 PM

I got goosebumps from reading some of that. lol
That sounds like WWII, hearing it be told by someone who lived through it, or something along those lines.

#4 Krim

Krim

    Advanced Member

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 1824 posts

Posted 31 March 2006 - 08:26 PM

(From Vswan):
There are many other people that were deeper involved in the old clan wars then I was, but I did witness it all from the beginning to the end. I will attempt to relate what happened without pointing fingers at anyone, or condemning either side. So much of what happened was based on the player mentality at the time.... a time when guides weren't needed for transactions (for the most part) and a players word actually had weight.

In the old days when a player did something disrespectful or bent the rules in there favor. The players of the game would align themselves and either PK, trash talk, black ball, or block a player from playing. Rumors and gossip would float around about evil deeds (shout and gossip were global channels) and the players would begin to align.

There was no system code to encourage or discourage any sort of war, but Enigma clan #2 rallied much of the game into a frenzy over the play of Clan #10 Dark order. Dark Order had a few very creative player .. maybe geniuses... but they used those powers to benefit themselves and at times, at the cost of many others. So began the trash talking and hate mongering.

Things continued to esculate and allies of each clan got drug into the fighting... and Enigma at one point announced, EVERY clan, player and charactor in the game will HAVE to pick a side, they are either with us or against us. This was a bold move and really changed the entire game because Engima DID attack and kill every clan, player and charactor that didn't publicly support and back their movement. IF a player wasn't interested in getting or being involved they were sucked into the war by Enigma's killing....The down side is it created alot of dislike for the clan and even today they carry that old stigma.
Eventually Dark Order was beaten and left the game and Enigma reined supreme. (Please understand this is VERY generic and MUCH happened in that time .... maybe 2 yearish)

Some of the things that happened along the way. (Also generalized and glossed over to prevent any distrust towards players or IMM that might have "gone out of bounds".)

Remember the goal was PK, trash talk, black ball, or block a player from playing.(AND removing them from the game AT ANY COST.) Many clans were stolen, charactors hacked, the moat was blocked just about 24/7 (Enigma mostly), The keep was blocked and trunks locked down. Players cheated, lied and backstabbed each other... friendships were lost because of picking one side or another. Brother against brother and every player had a price and often they sold out on thier clan or friends. Most fountains and springs were poisoned, any food on the ground was poisoned. Naked pictures were posted on web sites along with players addresses and phone numbers as WELL as player WORK phone numbers.(I'm sure some lost their jobs cause they picked the wrong side) Moongate was hacked an held for ransom (for 2 days)and a few Immortals had picked sides as well and created unfortunate situations, and immortal distrust.

Most of the old players look back with fond memories. It was very exciting , dramatic and choatic. Every day was an adventure in survival, with clan PK happening the the streets of all towns all over the world... getting from one side of town to another could be a serious challenge. It really was an excitting time to be in the game.

I hope that helps you understand the basics of what happened.

Vswan



When Text Gamers Attack!

#5 Vswan

Vswan

    Advanced Member

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 256 posts

Posted 31 March 2006 - 08:40 PM

*grin* Chaos and drama make for wonderfully exciting tales of survival ... or non survival a the case may be.

One thing is certain you can't weave a great tale from the average and normal.

Vswan

#6 Vaine

Vaine

    Advanced Member

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 1472 posts

Posted 01 April 2006 - 03:03 PM

I'm not understanding how having your character hacked, maimed and brutalized, having all your personal crap displayed everywhere, and losing your job over a text game could be considered fun...

Also, from the sounds of things, you're saying anyone could be killed anywhere, even out of PK, and at any level? I must be missing something, because that doesn't sound like a very enjoyable game.

If some of that was sarcasm, I totally missed it.

#7 Vswan

Vswan

    Advanced Member

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 256 posts

Posted 01 April 2006 - 06:18 PM

Well the PK clan were PK'ing everywhere , If you weren't in a PK clan, Areas of NPK and CPK were haunted and stalked.

you are correct Vaine. Much of it wasn't fun, the main reason I posted was to make it known that those days weren't rainbows and sunny days. EVERYONE that went through it came out with stories of excitement and adventure, but dont get me wrong it was a tough time to survive.

#8 Guest_zarath_*

Guest_zarath_*
  • Guests

Posted 01 April 2006 - 07:50 PM

Eh, it may have been upsetting to get CPKed for the first time... But there was a good risk, and you learnt your lesson usually the first time. I found it a lot of fun.

#9 Nalithien

Nalithien

    Advanced Member

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 484 posts

Posted 02 April 2006 - 09:45 AM

So... the question is: How do we go back to those times? I would love nothing more than to have clan wars and ship combat.

#10 Krim

Krim

    Advanced Member

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 1824 posts

Posted 02 April 2006 - 10:06 AM

Isn't Nalithien the person who started clan 118, and hates outlaws? :freaked:

#11 Tamlin

Tamlin

    Advanced Member

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 811 posts

Posted 02 April 2006 - 03:48 PM

I have fond memories of those times. All be it i was one of a few ppl who stayed in middle ground rather than choose any side and I spent many an hour going through the moat. I have no doubt thats where "Bravery" came from. I remember struggling to get by Reese and some of the other enigma (known by a much more dirogitory term then) crew. It was exciting you did learn quickly what you could and couldnt do. It did take a real strong clan effort just to break out and do runs. Have to realize some of the major differences in game tactics that we have now didnt exist then. they had to RS you in or line up 3 or 4 people in the cpk blocks and nail you with web at just the right time etc. so no matter how big or small there was always some chance you could pass. snares changed a lot of that.

But i also agree with Vswan. It was a tough time to survive. Even the best of the best got nailed but pk was populous and in my opinion not nearly as skewed as it is now. Clans were stronger then. A lot was still newer.

Some of the even bigger factors became pk records (Now ppl dont fight like that because omg it might ruin the pk records) stat trackers, knowing everything about how saves worked etc. Ppl looked into it then dont get me wrong but not like it is now. Very few camped classes like they did now we just leveled up and trained. No one was worried about every single stat on a sheet or how it affected this that or the other. They took the character they built and loved building and went balls to the walls wild with it. People enjoyed the game not analyzed it to a T. OMG 5 saves made it so i should delete my char is not something you would have heard back then. It was okay time to figure out new tactics. You would get together with your clannies test things out till you found a way that did good damage and go back to the fights.

I dont remember a whole lot of PK Whining either. Lots of trash talk but no you killed me 2v1 and but you silenced me etc. People because strategists you would have 2 ppl laying at the pg side of the moat two ppl in the caves and when that one person engaged you called all troops. You ended up annihilating someone and gearing them. They indeed called their clannies/allies, who had a return strategy. It was war.

You either trusted your clan or you didnt. And even then you really bonded with certain ppl you knew you could trust because as Vswan said it became an everyone had their price kind of world. Then you had a rare few that clung to honor at a high cost.

Would i wish for it again. I am not sure, most likely not. It was a great time to be remembered but everything since seems like a sad attempt to imitate the situation. Locking down keeps and attempted moat locks. Everyones so busy looking at their character to look up and remember to just have fun.

#12 Solus

Solus

    Advanced Member

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 7574 posts

Posted 02 April 2006 - 04:39 PM

snares changed a lot of that.


For note, even before it was tweaked, snare was useful; however, people just didn't use them. :?

#13 Vanadia

Vanadia

    Advanced Member

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 74 posts

Posted 02 April 2006 - 09:55 PM

Well, I for one would'nt like to see ALL of that back. However, I would LOVE to see some sort of clan-war type system imped. I know Pk clans offer something like this, but I mean something more. Maybe have some way to make halls more then just a recall point, a place to idle, or a place to kill your hunter. Clanhalls could be more like a fort, a place of refuge. I want to see something more intersting happen with clans! This new ship combat could be added into the mix. I know now clans have allies and enemies. But all it is, is a line in their MOTD or clan rules saying "Hey, don't kill them" or "Kill these people on site." If there was some more official way to have allies/enemies, that would also be cool. It sounds to be like Pk was at it's highest at this point. We all know Pk is declining, and I don't want to see that happen. Clan Pk would most definately has a chance to bring Pk back.

This is all I have for now, but please, give me your ideas. I know a lot of you are amazing brain-stormers and thinkers and could add so much to this. I want to see Pk on the rise, and I want to see clans taking a bigger part!

#14 Deathslayer

Deathslayer

    Advanced Member

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 271 posts

Posted 03 April 2006 - 10:31 AM

Snares worked quite well back then. I used them alot, but then the change happened, and everywhere was sold out. In fact, if I remember correctly my snares worked better then, than they do now and it was practiced less.

#15 Minotorious

Minotorious

    Advanced Member

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 5271 posts

Posted 03 April 2006 - 12:14 PM

the only thing preventing wars from starting is the players...the players simply do not care enough nowadays. in addition, the pk'rs are spread WAYYYYYYYYYYYY to thin among the clans to cover the game world now.
74 clans averaging 19 members per clan(1452 clan members / 74 clans) - many people of whom have multiple alts in clan(s) - is way too much for clans to matter on a large scal imho...there may be a few exceptions such as clan 81 but for the most part, clans are meaningless.

#16 Vanadia

Vanadia

    Advanced Member

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 74 posts

Posted 03 April 2006 - 01:35 PM

for the most part, clans are meaningless.



My point exactly. Which is why this could make what clan you are in matter. People sometimes won't join a certain clan because of the hall location, obviously the recall point matters more then anything to them. This will force people to want to be in a clan for a stronger "army" and to Pk their enemies. This will make clans more meaningful, and hopefully get Pk back where it should be.

It's definately something to consider. Ship combat was an idea that is going to bring more fun to the game, and probably bring in a sufficient amount of money to Vassago from RU sale. Clan war could do the same thing, but IMO would be more interesting and fun. At the same time, it may help revive Pk (which could in turn, cause RU sales to rise) and it will make clans more meaningful and fun.

Opinions/input? Do tell.

#17 Vswan

Vswan

    Advanced Member

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 256 posts

Posted 03 April 2006 - 07:25 PM

I'm curious to any ideas people might have, seems to me, for clan wars to exsist clans would have to protect/defend something also attack/gain something.

what those benefits might be is beyond me. I dont know if a clan should spend their roots on something like a hall or chest to have it stolen away. Maybe some other trophy or series of trophys. Horn of great shouts... I dont know.

Vswan

#18 Helmsley

Helmsley

    Advanced Member

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 2830 posts

Posted 03 April 2006 - 07:31 PM

horn of great shouts? lol, sounds like a legacy from Quiet.

#19 Vanadia

Vanadia

    Advanced Member

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 74 posts

Posted 03 April 2006 - 10:28 PM

I'm curious to any ideas people might have, seems to me, for clan wars to exsist clans would have to protect/defend something also attack/gain something.

what those benefits might be is beyond me. I dont know if a clan should spend their roots on something like a hall or chest to have it stolen away.


-
Exactly. As far as the clan halls maybe being taken over, I don't think that would be fair. However, maybe clans can have other smaller buildings scattered around the world for the that may be conquered by other clans involved in the war. I just think it'll make things more fun to have some clans working together other then just 59 forming to Pk people. :P I'd like to see other things, fun things. Obviously there would have to be caps on much of this to prevent clans like Enigma taking over single "clan hideout" in the game. There is a lot to expand on this, I really want to hear what people think and many many more ideas that you have, because I'm interested as well.

#20 Urglana

Urglana

    Advanced Member

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 2022 posts

Posted 03 April 2006 - 11:34 PM

1) Fix PG. The amount of MFDs and diamond gemstones in this game make walking the moat a joke (so much so that first classers and low second classers can get bravery with very little to no trouble), on top of the fact that it's exponentially more difficult to get there. No one goes there for tourms (why bother when everyone's just getting easier tourms in Verity?) anymore. Perhaps make verity tourms untransferrable? vis-death, nouncurse, etc.

2) Remove the saturation of clans in the game. Do this by increasing taxes, or perhaps just sitting down and saying "Okay, you have one month to gain 10,000 roots. Any clan that doesn't make due gets removed." People would care more if there weren't so many open member slots, or if removing from your clan wouldn't just mean moving to a different exactly the same clan.

3) Put more PK rooms back in the game. Add PK back to the newbie towns. It's sad to see places like FGK and Odious have LPK and NPK, but nooo, can't give Sigil its LPK back.

#21 Helmsley

Helmsley

    Advanced Member

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 2830 posts

Posted 03 April 2006 - 11:59 PM

wtf? more pk rooms? we are talking about clan pk, aren't we? give more incentives to clans to turn their pk flags on and we can have clan pk back easily.

#22 Einherjer

Einherjer

    Advanced Member

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 180 posts

Posted 04 April 2006 - 04:47 AM

lpk back in sigil would help alin ppl with clan sides give them a reason to get mad at a clan or help the clan out by baiting, i think we need to put most of the pk that was taken out from everywhere, and i don't like the vis-death tourms from verity but i like the nouncurse coz dieing in verity happens and if your carrying all your tourms and you hit a trap your screwd. sorry for the run on.

#23 Minotorious

Minotorious

    Advanced Member

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 5271 posts

Posted 04 April 2006 - 09:53 AM

How about modify the clan-pk structure to have two types of clan pk, restricted and regular

Members of restricted pk clans would only be able to attack/be attacked by people within say 30 levels of each other, members of regular pk clans included, heroes/archons would always be able to attack each other

members of regular pk clans would be able to attack any other member of a regular pk clan, and any member of a restricted pk clan within the level range.

I think this would see a rise in the participation in clan pk as people who start doing it earlier in their playing time are probably going to be more likely to continue in clan pk when they reach hero/archon

-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-

Add into the game some pk clan ranking system in which the more your clan clan-pk's relative to the # of members, the higher your ranking is (with appropriate limits for # of kills per member per opponent in a given month to avoid abuse) and as your ranking is higher you get some additional tax reduction/clan-wide qp reward from Lord maldra at the end of the month/or some other incentive with the prize of course being more lucrative the higher your clan is ranked

-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-

Add useful equipment with flags along the lines of

*Your clans 'pk' flag must be equal to true to equip the item

modify items with the line

*This item has a default life span of x days and will expire on

to have clan-pking extend the life-span of the items. Would especially boost clan pk-ing if donation items were included i believe :twisted:

-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-

#24 Tamlin

Tamlin

    Advanced Member

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 811 posts

Posted 04 April 2006 - 04:51 PM

and on the flip side? How are you going to compensate those who dont wish to spend their days pking ppl. Some clans and alliances spend their time helping people rather that KOS everyone they see.

There is plenty of pk in the game. The size of the gaming world has become bigger than the population thats one of the major reasons pk has slowed. Its no longer the days of 30+ ppl in the moat or keep at a time. Theres so much pk and the world is so expansive and becoming bigger but the playerbase basic numbers have stayed fairly close to what they have been for a long time.

If you want to increase pk increase players. If you want to increase donations increase players. Stop allowing ppl to decimate new players and treat them badly.

Im all for having fun, pk or otherwise and allow myself to do what i think is fun. some days its see how i fare in pk other days its to see if i can get away with doing some cpk run i want to do sometimes i spend my entire day sitting in rune helping ppl out.

Forcing the game into a situation where you have to pk to renew your donation items or where you have to pk to keep your clan working right to me are the wrong directions to head in unless you are going to compliment both sides which up to this point seems to be fairly hard to get ppl to do as PK is the major focus of this game as it is. Even Ship Combat comes before Ship Trading. To me it would have made more sense to impliment ship trading and let people get used to the trading system and setup runs and practice fighting mobs before unleashing pk battles with multi million gp ships or $200.00+ ships. However i also understand that a good amount of the player base would object because its not pk oriented. Life is not pk all the time. You dont have to max your character before moving up the ladder etc. If I as a druid max my healing skills and invoke evoks that would help with runs as a Healer then i have a RUN function.

Stop trying to put the focus on PK so much. Its not the only thing driving this game. It wasnt even when pk was rampant. I was as much in those pk wars as most people back in the day but i can say there was also a lot more to being in a clan than just protection. It was about the runs you could do or what you wanted to do. Some ppl opened ferry services, some opened shops, some were the runners, some were pk, some were helpers. That was the biggest difference of all. Every player had a niche to go to and something to do that they had fun doing. If they didnt want to be plagued by pk they didnt have to be.

So while i understand people wanting to see clan pks and pk setups become more used. Its not by adding more pk related things. Rewards are already there for entering pk as it is. Quests at high levels are mostly in pk and cpk. Runs are almost always in PK and CPK. Trunks are in PK. People enter pk now as they need. Forcing ppl to enter pk situations even more is only gonna restrict that many more things to people. Actually i think you use the already existing pk flags and then expand other flags for clans if anything. Like merchants - Clan Shops, Traders - Clan Trading Runs. Create more things to do when pk is light or more ways for people to aquire decent eq and i think you will see when the item that they would wear isnt 20 mill they might actually go there.

#25 Garrison

Garrison

    Advanced Member

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 80 posts

Posted 04 April 2006 - 06:27 PM

I remember the clan wars. I was on Enigma's side at the time but with allied clans since I switched a few times. It was pretty intense and I know a lot of the old players stopped playing the game now so not many of them exist or are left that still remember. Vswan is right though about most, players had to pick the side your on either Enigma or DO or with there allied clans, or stay in a neutral clan. If you had access to the old moongate pages they had stories of the wars :P

Garrison